Let's shape future of this group

Yeeeeeaaaa! At least one person with adequate brain.
You are absolutely right about CPUs and servers.
My server at home has intel core I5 despites it is built in 2020.
Because I5 consumes less power which is important because i pay every month for this power. And also it requires less cooling and so it stands almost silent most part of a time.
Should I upgrade it to the best and powerfull I9 with last generation just to get raw power and pay much more every month and suffer every night because the coolers will try to simulate a helicopter and generate lots of noise?
Of course no.

-- (karmien):
Sorry to say but the way you get so emotional about your own, apparently incomplete, knowledge about servers shows how much you should administer something. And may i remind you that a server is not a gaming pc and may not always need the all newest high end cpu? I also have 2 servers, one of them also having an a bit older cpu. Is it bad? No, because it's mainly used for storage and i have my other server to handle the mor cpu related things. In some cases it just doesn't make sense to always keep upgrading a server but to ballance the work over onto multiple servers. But yeah, we are going pretty of topic, i am basically waiting for dash since he said he would contact Pajper or for Pajper him self to confirm that candidates can apply again and then leave this topic for good.
-- (SightlessWolf):
yeah, sure it is. Reliable servers, maybe with processors from 10 years ago. I expect you, and Arctic moon, for that matter, to link real sources or shut the fuck up with these ridiculous claims

--

--

Thank you very much, i will check those links, they look really interesting.
And yes, this could be an argument, that he started to develop Elten 10 years ago when he knew only ruby.
But what i see now is that a "freemium" product receives not so frequent updates, bugs are not fixed and elten stays as slow as it was.
For a good developer this is the point where he should stop and think more about optimization or about changing something.
As we see NVDA started from Python 2.7 and it was much slower 10 years ago.
And what happened?
yes, they wanted more speed and modern features and they rewrote some parts in C++, they switched from py2 to py3, they even migrate now to py3.11 from py3.7 thanks god for that!
They switched from old legacy WinMM to modern WASAPI because of its speed and new features.
They do develop and they do think about user experience, they do accept issues and feature requests.


-- (daszekmdn):
I didn't saw these discussions but i think that he told that when he started to writing Elten he didn't had experience and knew only Ruby.
At the time, indeed, it was. As for evidence of knowledge of other languages, I have seen several. Here's a list of them with sources:
Octarine App for OCR in Polish:
https://octarine.pl
Windows app for Tyflopodcast, a first Polish potcast for the blind
https://github.com/dawidpieper/tyflopodcast
Way of text contact during the online broadcasts:
https://kontakt.tyflopodcast.net
Srebrny labirynt, audio game from 2013:
https://srebrnylabirynt.pl
3D models and programs by Prowadnica foundation, i think written by Pajper:
https://www.printables.com/pl/@prowadnica_911618
https://github.com/prowadnica
Private Pajper's Github Pajper where you can find various things in various languages which was mentionet abowe:
https://github.com/dawidpieper
Any other questions? Programmers must know how to do research, Google, Bing, etc. All things can be found in few minutes if you only want or need it.

--

Actually there are constelations that, when you just keep upgrading a server, it costs more then just renting multiple and clustering them. And when we are already talking about reliability it is not a good idea to rely everything on one single server since if that one fails, good night. Of course there are some people that exagerate on buying servers (some organisations just have way to much money). For example it doesn't make sense to buy 3 vps with 512 mb ram and think that is a good idea since they will just all run bad most of the time. But over here i have combined 96gb of ram and 9tb diskspace for around 70 dollars a month. Both with 1gb data port and an average speed of 850 mbits in most speedtests.
-- (cyrmax):
Yeeeeeaaaa! At least one person with adequate brain.
You are absolutely right about CPUs and servers.
My server at home has intel core I5 despites it is built in 2020.
Because I5 consumes less power which is important because i pay every month for this power. And also it requires less cooling and so it stands almost silent most part of a time.
Should I upgrade it to the best and powerfull I9 with last generation just to get raw power and pay much more every month and suffer every night because the coolers will try to simulate a helicopter and generate lots of noise?
Of course no.

-- (karmien):
Sorry to say but the way you get so emotional about your own, apparently incomplete, knowledge about servers shows how much you should administer something. And may i remind you that a server is not a gaming pc and may not always need the all newest high end cpu? I also have 2 servers, one of them also having an a bit older cpu. Is it bad? No, because it's mainly used for storage and i have my other server to handle the mor cpu related things. In some cases it just doesn't make sense to always keep upgrading a server but to ballance the work over onto multiple servers. But yeah, we are going pretty of topic, i am basically waiting for dash since he said he would contact Pajper or for Pajper him self to confirm that candidates can apply again and then leave this topic for good.
-- (SightlessWolf):
yeah, sure it is. Reliable servers, maybe with processors from 10 years ago. I expect you, and Arctic moon, for that matter, to link real sources or shut the fuck up with these ridiculous claims

--

--

--

Yep, i also agree in fact that Elten need to be optimised but because of some bad ideas from the first versions and years of creation it's partially impossible.
Elten need to be rewrited from scrath, but Pajper is only one person which have also another projects.
But Okay, someone can say that it don't care him.
But there's another really huge argument why it wasn't did:
Community. If elten don't getting new features for some time or bugs aren't fixed community getting to be mad. You, Me, Pajper, and other people who tried any programming language or are more technicial than typical user know that it need to be done, but another no.
There was a poll about it or discussion few years ago in Polish community and not technician users wanted new features, not complete rewrite. To rewrite it by one person it can took few months or years if the programmer have private life and doing it as hobby. Remember that Pajper don't get any money for he's work on Elten. All the money goes to maintain the servers.
The foundation does not make money on Elten, and often has to subsidize it from its private pocket.

I'm still very curious though. Because if I remember 25 Euros is like $30US. That's usually the 2nd or 3RD tier servers a provider has on offer. I know there are really cheap servers, I know the Germans are infamous for having cheap servers.

Yes that's my bad, I should have remembered. I'm sorry.
Now that you're saying all of this, I remember and know what you are about. :)
-- (cyrmax):
Sorry Arctic but i cannot provide any links, unfortunately.
I don't remember if i allready explained the situation to you, but as you know we cannot pay for anything from russian bank cards. And so i have a friend who helps me renting those things because his wife is not a citizen of Russia and has a bank card from another country.
And yes, this friend always tries to find the best posibilities, best prices, always asks for help for a blind people foundations, etc.
This is what called a good manager work. So thats how i have a dedicated server for 25 euro per month, thats how tiflo games have a stable and free server for their project, thats how blind people in Russia can ask for a small place to host their site for free if they just want to learn system administration or practice their web programming skills.


-- (ArcticMoon):
As soon as Cyrmax wakes up, I'll ask him to log in and provide you links from where he gets his server. Even if we already couldn't be closer, since I'm not a programmer, he doesn't tell about such stuff to me, as he thinks I'm not really interested :)
I saw the way his servers work, the speed and effectiveness, and all I can say I'm sure it's not some old garbage an usual blindy buys because having a server is fun.
He uses them professionally, with the required skills to operate a full environment.
Let's be honest. Throwing out large numbers is one thing. 500 blogs alltogether, 10000 private messages, millions of posts, etc. But text is just a few kbs of storage, and doesn't require that much CPU and RAM either. What's more difficult here is the encoder, the speech to text for sponsors, and maybe the high quality conferencing system. For which, even I, with a naive mind, can't imagine why a different server doesn't exist.

--

--

We cannot be sure that he does not get money from Elten. hmmm....
But at least if he make a public api, we could write a new elten client which would operate better.

-- (daszekmdn):
Yep, i also agree in fact that Elten need to be optimised but because of some bad ideas from the first versions and years of creation it's partially impossible.
Elten need to be rewrited from scrath, but Pajper is only one person which have also another projects.
But Okay, someone can say that it don't care him.
But there's another really huge argument why it wasn't did:
Community. If elten don't getting new features for some time or bugs aren't fixed community getting to be mad. You, Me, Pajper, and other people who tried any programming language or are more technicial than typical user know that it need to be done, but another no.
There was a poll about it or discussion few years ago in Polish community and not technician users wanted new features, not complete rewrite. To rewrite it by one person it can took few months or years if the programmer have private life and doing it as hobby. Remember that Pajper don't get any money for he's work on Elten. All the money goes to maintain the servers.
The foundation does not make money on Elten, and often has to subsidize it from its private pocket.

--

There, is a public api, feel free and lets go. I'd love to see a new elten client with useful functions, go ahead!
L O L

I am sorry but give please a link to this public API.
And is it docummented properly and has the same set of methods which official client uses?


-- (Jonathan):
There, is a public api, feel free and lets go. I'd love to see a new elten client with useful functions, go ahead!
L O L

--

Well, what do you expect from elten? Its documented in polish as far as I know, and I am sure that its not as awesome as you wish it to don't find anything to complain about.

It's on the Github I think. I remember seeing it when I tried downloading the client

The worst thing is complaining about a person when you don't even reach up to them or have valid suggestions of improvement which you, could personally exicute. Learned that myself.

It's all in the pajper repository. Now is the time to demonstrate what is known and what is not.

I say this since there are quite a few programmers, the time has come to make contributions, which is really ideal

Says someone who was complaining for weeks after the vote didn't end with a result you wanted. About a person, who you haven't even reached out to, don't even know who the person is in real life. I'm seeing double standards again.


-- (marchoffmann):
The worst thing is complaining about a person when you don't even reach up to them or have valid suggestions of improvement which you, could personally exicute. Learned that myself.

--

Pajper has other different projects and that's cool, I'm not denying anything. But to be honest he has much more than he can manage alone. He's always in a rush, ignores even community administrators and moderators, and after that, when sees a community collapsing, he already can't do anything because he manages too many projects all at once that's already not possible and realistic alone.
That's why we are getting a lot of big, clever words, large numbers, so a naive user will be surprised without thinking. But all in all 500 blogs aren't that much, 10000 private messages in text are nothing compared to anything more serious, should I continue? These are just large numbers to let the average user wonder and take back his words. On the other side, a programmer knows this all and laughs.
I had a similar groupmate at university. When I didn't know how to set up windows properly, he kept telling me it's difficult as hell because all the drivers and programs and everything, don't even try because it's difficult as hell. Once I was obligated to set up windows on a laptop so I had to try. I set up a virtual machine, on that system I knew I can't do anything wrong. I went through the setup and I was all set. After that I went up to my roommate, who asked me to set up her computer and I did everything without mistakes, and don't forget it's very very very difficult, if we believe the words of my previous groupmate.
After that I didn't believe anything but if I wanted to try something, I read about it myself and decided if it's easy or difficult for me to try.

@775 stop exagerating. I only made the petition like 2 or 3 days after the vote ended. Furthermore, people have a right to voice their condemnation of your distasteful stunt. Let's not go there again.

Well, Cyrmax, actions speak louder than words, so do it. If you think you can optimize this program, please contribute and prove it.

By the way, I'm surprised that a person who can't prove almost any of what he writes about has the nerve to accuse me of lying. Virtually everything I wrote about, except for school projects, is easy to prove, because there are so many different articles.
Basically, my programming activity can be traced back to 2013 easily.

Where is a public elten api, and are you sure you are not confusing it with the server repo which has not been updated since 3 years and is probably not latest anymore? I may be wrong here though, @pajper could you pls correct me if i am.